They tell me that the LIE is closed except for emergency personel. My presence in NYC will probably be a hinderance. One more car one more mouth to feed. I long to connect with my friends I miss Diane. No, we don't live together. I want to hear the music to do SOMETHING. I know I will be bringing in supplies from out in Suburban hell.

To all my friends, have a toast for each other, for those who cannot be and for those who will never return.

may the forces of Truth and Light prevail.
Diety bless,

T

I understand the resentment towards the bigotry in our society. This bigotry exists in all societies. It is not justified in any way. However, if you think you are ill treated in the United States, just take a trip to Afghanistan and see what they do to faggots over there.

I cannot believe that some of you are suggesting that these acts were in some way justified. This was nothing but the mass murder of innocents out of blind irrational hatred. These religious bigots make our home grown variety appear incredibly docile, in my humble opinion.

I dont think anyone on these boards is suggesting the attacks were justified. However, when something rotten happens to me or I find myself in a terrible situation - I ask myself "Well, how did I get here?". I believe US Policy is partly to blame for creating these monsters. They are not simply "evil" while we are "good -- although their horrifying, unconscionable acts certainly were. But instead of merely seeking revenge which Im certain we will do (was there ever any question?)- We cannot hope to forcefully annihilate all hatred against us without understanding why we are hated in the first place. Is it a sign of weakness to ask ourselves: Are we 100% right in our support of Israel right or wrong? Is what we are doing in the world right? We wont get them all if they keep replacing themselves with passionate young zealots who feel the US is to blame for their woes. The question is: How much of the blame for the creation of 'terrorists' is ours?

I agree that I don't believe anyone on these boards is saying that the attacks against America (and the world for that matter) were justified. What I believe people are trying to say is that those who are screaming loudest for America -as the home of the free and the brave - are often those who are in direct violation in word and action against the "principles" America is supposed to stand for. They are those that make racist, homophobic and xenophobic jokes, exclude anyone not of their race, class, gender, or creed and even commit hate crimes against anyone percieved as "other". There is also no doubt that minorities are treated worse in other countries. And there is no doubt these attacks were blind acts of hatred resulting in the loss of thousands of innocent lives. However, that doesn't make America faultless in its cruelty. America does have its own demons (Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Japanese Holding Camps in WWII, Vietnam, etc.). All I believe people are expressing here is that any blind group mentality is scary - it is (possibly to a lesser degree?) the same mentality that the terrorists responsible very well may have had. The time is not for widespread fear or hatred of another race or country. And I believe one can still feel sad for her country and angered by these attacks but still question everything before waving the flag as an empty gesture. I am proud that there is still freedom for us as Americans to express our ideas and share our opinions through channels such as this board. And for that I'll raise a glass.

Eve,
That's it exactly. Couldn't have said it better.

Meanwhile, I continue to be amazed at how completely uninspiring, false and at times frightening our President appears. I watched with unsettled apprehension his national address the night of the attack .... the man has little or no public speaking ability at ALL. He looked so awkward, with his silly and obviously rehearsed hand gestures, patently insincere and downright unintelligent. He inspires no confidence whatsoever and gives no impression that he has a clue! It continues to amaze me that we have ended up with this listless, spoiled and arrogant frat boy as our president. He's not even a good figurehead, spokesmodel or front man - he's nothing! His staff members speak better than he does! And Dick Cheney - whom we haven;t seen nor heard from since the attack - is probably lying dead somewhere in an underground bunker of the White House and we're just not being told about it. The man can hardly lift a ball point pen without having a heart attack, let alone terrorist strikes on the Pentagon!

Of course, if the administration is smart they'll dispense with the armed forces and just drop Communications Director/Wonder Dyke Karen Hughes in a parachute over Afghanastan. That'll fix the terrorists right and proper!

Eve is a genius! I agree, what makes me sadder than the loss of so much life is the idiots attacking muslim homes, businesses and houses of worship. If that is America ,send me to Mexico! I fear we will have to see as many anti-muslim bumper stickers and t-shirts as cheap little American flags waving.

this is the worst text i have ever read!
was he waving a flag while giving his speech?

http://www.gay.com/news/article.html?2001/09/14/1

This is the first time I have been on the boards since the tragedy, and I have to say...Eve, you are brilliant. I was with scott Lifschutz the other night and we were pouring over pictures of this years wigstock. It seemed like messages from another time. All the beauty in this community calling to us from that amazing day to remind us, on the other side of Tuesday, that we have a responsibility to carry on and keep up all the things that have made downtown special. I keep getting calls telling me to leave. Where would I go ? I am afraid but I am still hopeful that humanity will somehow take a step back and consider how awful we have been to each other. I am so sick of being gay or straight or american or athiest or christian or a chelsea fag or an east village queen or whatever other tribes we can think to divide into. Is it hopelessly nieve of me to wish for a wave of kindness and love to sweep over us and cleanse us of the nationalism, and religious superstitions that have caused so many innocent, precious lives, so much sorrow and suffering for so many centuries? I hope not. I can't see any other way out of this. My love to everyone.

We who hug this city by instinct, grateful to it's grandure and creativity, in my humble opinion now have the mission to examine how people cope with the worst, as well as with the best in urban life, starting with myself.

Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson's comments, whose words and actions seek to capitalize on this human tragedy, show that there is a "Taliban" here in our own country, that seeks to undermine the very ideas of freedom and true faith with their hateful poses of piety. Fundamentalists such as these have been waging terrorism for years on medical professionals and abortion clinics, and their "Christian" rhetoric is an eerie echo of those faraway madmen. They have now revealed by their own words that although they claim to speak in God's name, their true purposes are to divide American unity and sow seeds of misery and hate in this hour when civilization turns to love and compassion.

Robertson has a history of making overt threats; in June 1998 he stated on the 700 Club that the city of Orlando could suffer "terrorist bombs...earthquakes, tornadoes and possibly a meteor" because the city flew gay pride flags. Despite Falwell's "backpeddling" to CNN (after he had already broadcast his message of hate to his following, no report of a retraction to that community), it's clear that this is part of a long-standing agenda to promulgate fear and hatred among Americans.GLAAD article

thank you for your eloquent comments Evelyn.

the kind of people like falwell, who scare me almost more than the terrororists. Just what sorry excuse for a human!

Father Mychal Judge, the NYC Fire Department Chaplain who perished, along with many others in that first wave of emergency response to "Ground Zero, was an openly gay priest, a fact the media seems to have "overlooked."

[This message was edited by hatches on 09-15-01 at 04:49 PM.]

I came across this poem by W. H. Auden, written at the dawn of another war.

http://www.poets.org/poems/poems.cfm?prmID=1391

OK, so this is the poem that the famous "We must love one another or die" quote comes from.

I've heard that in later publications of this piece, Auden made one slight, but significant change -- revising to "We must love one another *AND* die". Not sure what else to say about that, except "noted as interesting"...

BTW, I'm Kathy Latzoni... if you're subscribed to the motherlove list, my intro/self-description is posted there as message #173. [or, if you're fascinated enough, the updated version appears at http://www.gothics.org/c7/east.html , under "New York"...]

Hope everyone's friends and families are okay.

Yr obt svt,

Kathy L.

Hi Kathy! Nice to see you here.

Hatches, thanks so much for that poem. We loved it so much that JD did a new graphic of
one verse of it with the Mother's End image for the top page at mothernyc.com. (Press link above left to see)

Thanks, Hatch, for that INFORMATION on Father Judge so GROSSLY omitted in the general media. The moral of that story: As far as concerns the general viewing public for which the mass media whores, this is a crisis of FAMILY values from which perverts are excluded, as in all exercises of NORMAL society.
Falwell said his comments were misunderstood because they were "sound bytes" taken out of context in a "long theological discussion" which must have continued long after the cameras stopped rolling since nothing in the actual broadcast justified them, but he and his followers just assume on faith that Reverend Falwell knows best, for them and everybody, and such long theological discussions are so far beyond the general comprehension that it's needless and pointless to explain to us idiots and degenerates. FUCK HIM! He just substitutes the English word "God" for the terrorists' "Allah"

[This message was edited by xtzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz on 09-17-01 at 04:07 PM.]

[This message was edited by xtzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz on 09-17-01 at 04:10 PM.]